Discipline for Promoting
Responsibility and Learning

Presented by Marvin Marshall, Ed.D.
About Dr. Marshall

Dear Fellow PDK Member:

When you discipline a student and become stressed, then the student is controlling the situation. This is not how it should be.

From my K-12 teaching experiences, my counseling experiences, and my K-12 administrative experiences, I have developed a three-step dscipline approach that is now used in 43 states and in 14 countries on five continents. A few reasons that this simple-to-implement system is gaining such popularity is that it motivates students to behave responsibly and put forth effort to learn. It eliminates the usual self-defending that is a major source of confrontation between teacher and student.

My teaching and learning model differs from traditional coercive and manipulative approaches that aim toward promoting obedience. Upon reflection, you will realize that this objective has a policeman’s mindset because the primary purpose is one of obedience. Obedience simply does not create desire. In fact, aiming at obedience often induces teacher stress and student resistance. In contrast, when an approach is used where students are motivated to be responsible, obedience follows as a natural by-product.

You will gain significantly by participating because you will learn how to handle classroom disruptions simply and easily, use authority without resorting to punishment, raise individual and social responsibility, improve your learning climate, reduce negative peer influence, reduce bullying, reduce apathy toward learning, and reduce your stress.

Discipline without Stress® is a powerful and exciting approach that is used across the entire teaching spectrum—in all grade levels and in all subject areas. To learn more, please take a moment and review www.MarvinMarshall.com. While there, sign up for the free, monthly newsletter about promoting responsibility and learning, increasing effectiveness, and improving relationships.

I look forward to significantly enhancing your joy in the teaching profession.

Sincerely,

Marv Marshall, Ed.D.

Author of “Discipline without Stress® Punishments or Rewards - How Teachers and Parents Promote Responsibility & Learning”.

 

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Please read:

Here is a direct link to the Marvin Marshall Teaching Model. Dr. Marshall will be referring to parts I, II, III, IV of this model in his discussion responses.

Here is a link to an article in the March 2004 Kappan, about Marshall's system for school discipline.

If you wish, sign up for Dr. Marshall's email subscription to stay informed on this topic beyond this program.

Return to this window to post your questions or comments for Dr. Marshall. Return often June 10 through 14 to find his replies and further discussion within the table below.

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Archived Discussion Posts

Name	Comment
Marion	This program will answer the question every teacher has had at some time in their teaching careers: how to motivate the uninterested learner. Learning spirals upwards as interest in learning grows, and less stress improves the teacher's teaching. It is a win-win situation.
barbara	Dr. Marshall, Your approach sounds heavenly. I can see how it lessens stress on the teacher and the student by allowing the student to be integral part in his or her own learning process. How does this approach work with students with personality disorders? For example, I have several clients that lack empathy, have an inflated sense of entitlement, and are essentially narcissistic in nature. Is there a special or modified approach of Discipline without Stress method for this population? I am always looking for new and innovative ways and your approach seems to be right on the money!
Jenny	I am anxious to discuss the initial transformative steps taken to change from the traditionally-oriented classsroom/teaching approach to the effective approach in Dr. Marshall's plan...particularly if we switch approaches mid-year. WELCOME, Dr. Marshall and All!
Marilyn	Hi Dr. Marshall, Thanks so much for joining us. I taught inner-city high school students math in the 1970s. Much of what is happening in schools today was also present then. You wrote: After these discussions, I wanted to prompt some reflection, and so I simply asked the students to analyze their own developmental level in the reading session that had just passed. After giving them a moment to think "in their heads," I asked them to honestly evaluate their own choices. I wanted them to think about whether or not their choices were leading them in a positive direction. Nothing more was said aloud, either by me or by the students, and they were left to reflect for a minute before we moved on to another lesson. In the 1980s I was involved in a program called EXCEL, which came up with similar conclusions that your excellent program is based on. Today I work primarily with doctoral students, and also conduct seminars in leadership. The principals are pretty universal: The Maps of Our Mind – Marilyn K. Simon, Ph.D. Super Learning and Accelerated Understanding - Adapted from EXCEL program 1987 1) Our information is either already encoded in us or it is received through our five senses or a combination of both. 2) Each person has a structure of how that information is dealt with. That structure is determined by their personal history and the surrounding circumstances. That structure is called a “map” and it determines one’s relationship with the outside world and their experiences of it. 3) The tools which everyone uses for map-building are simple: Distortion, deletion, and generalization. Every experience, every bit of information and feeling goes through that filter. 4) Because of our maps, there are no universal experiences, there are only approximations. Similar maps within others can produce similar experiences, feelings and understandings. 5) Our maps determine the boundaries of our lives and hence the choices available to us. Each person has, in any given situation a finite number of congruent choices available to them although the universe may offer an infinite number of choices. We only operate out of our perceived finite set of choices (our “choice bank”) not the universal choice bank. The complexity of our maps allows for incongruent behavior. 6) The human being is designed to draw from and choose the best possible choice for any given event (given their perceived outcome). The outcome always has a beneficial goal in mind (the “what”). Given the choices available, people always operate at 100% and always make quality decisions. 7) Since every person always makes the best decision possible, given their “choice bank” and “perceived outcome,” every labeling device such as lazy, slow, stupid, crazy, inappropriate, unsupportive, etc. are not accurate. The only observation which can be made when another makes a decision of action you don’t approve of is that they either lack choices or have a different perceived outcome, neither which deserves a critical remark. 8) Accordingly, the operating system which has the greatest number of available choices in its “choice bank” will be the controlling or dominant element in that situation. Increasing choices increases effectiveness. 9) The maps in our mind are the criteria for allowing new choices. It is only by altering our maps that we can make significant behavior changes. New information or experiences usually affects the content of the map, not the map itself. 10) Thus, the extent which you can estimate another’s choice bank, and the mapping structure, which allows for new choices, is the extent to which you can appreciate, respect, influence, know, empower and understand them. The key lies in effective communication.
David Kenneth Waldman	Welcome Dr Marshall I taught for 6 months in a inner city school where gangs, drugs, guns, fights to the death were common place in the neighborhood surrounding the school. As a long term substitute teacher I was assigned a lang arts class. My students in a typical class ranged from above average to a second grade reading level. The few that were not interested in learning became interested when I brought in Romeo and Juliet a version geared for the low level reader and all except one engaged as it mirrored their life and they could relate to the story. All even my 2 grade reading level student was reading Shakespear. The San Francisco Unified asst superintendent and some other important district person I forget now visited my class and was amazed that I was teaching Romeo and Juliet as it was not part of the standards for 8th grade. They didn't disapprove as they saw the students engaged and learning it just never occured to them to believe my students could handle this story. The many variables of environment, the home, how they are treated, the gangs and their influence, and so many factors have created disruptive behavior along with the lack of interest. Your approach I think will not work in all classrooms as it takes the teacher to see they are part of the disclipine problem and it takes the caliber of teacher rarely found today or they have burnt out and left the classroom. My question to the group and to you Dr. Marshall is how do you deal with the teacher that has to let go of control and trust that a student can be in charge of their own learning (Fiere) when there is so much pressure for teachers to meet No Child Left Behind performance tests. If a teacher does not control their teaching environment quickly they will be accountable for their students failing national tests. So the tendency for non motivating and stress creation is a negative cycle. I do not seeing this working so easily in inner city classrooms not because your method is not excellent and proven but that the reality of the lack of teacher skill and experience teaching in inner city schools is not to the level that would be able to meet all the demands place on them. It takes in my experience alot of creativity and flexiabilty and time to reach some students. As you read from my colleagues comments their experience and ability to understand various perspectives is part of my point as well as we as educators need to be talking more as Marilyn states to be having effective communication so that the educators and the scholars take the best of the best of the techniques create a toolbox so that a educator would have a variety of choices depending on the situation they are in and the personality and experience of the educator. Thank you Dr. Marshall as this allows the expansion of understanding of how to create less stress in the classroom and your contribution to this process is commendable and appreciated.
Sandy Wenzel	This system is terrific in my opinion. I have learned a lot about managing and teaching behaviors over the past 20 years as a special education teacher. Dr. Marshall’s approach focuses on responsibility and learning and is best practice for both teachers and children. I agree with stating rules and expectations in the positive, offering the student’s choices, and asking reflective questions. Choices empower students and when given the opportunity to “fix” the behaviors rather than receive a consequence imposed by an adult, most of the time, students will choose to fix it. Not all students learn to act in a certain manner just as all students do not learn to read in a certain manner. Children do not all automatically understand behavioral tasks. Breaking these seemingly simple tasks down into steps and teaching, modeling, and practicing them is what some children need. In Dr. Marshall’s model, it is significant that the individual children get to take responsibility for their actions which is what they seek. This coupled with positive recognition when appropriate behaviors are demonstrated can result in positive change.I would love to learn more about this.
Marion	As this method is for parents, also, I am asking for help on the behalf of several parents with children 13-16 years old who have become suddenly very sassy/mouthy to parents, but are impeccably behaved in school and elsewhere. Where does this rudeness to parents come from? Obviously the children are capable of making better choices in their mind/map bank, but choose not to do so at home. What steps can they take?
David Kenneth Waldman	Dr Marshall with the success of your model as Marion suggests that it is for parents as well. How do you reach parents that are single parents, or as I am working on a military base in Germany the parents that get deloyed to a war zone for 15 months at a time home a year and then deployed again. There are military parents that get forgotten.
Jenny	Like many of my colleagues here, the successes I've realized in own my work with inner-city students throughout the last two decades have reflected your approach, Dr. Marshall, although the self-motivation and mutual respect I tried to cultivate in my classes was based on teaching instincts, and not systematic enough to work as efficiently as it may have. I look forward to refining my methods through applying your model.
For Barbara	C.M. Charles 2008 publication, TODAY’S BEST CLASSROOM MANAGEMENT STRATEGIES: PATHS TO POSITIVE DISCIPLINE, devotes Chapter 10 to USING SPECIAL DISCIPLINE TACTICS TO HELP STUDENTS WITH NEUROLOGICAL-BASED BEHAVIOR. Although my program is described in Chapter 9, he (Carol is a male) includes one of my approaches in his Chapter 10. The section is entitled, MARVIN MARSHALL ON THE VALUE OF POSITIVE IMAGES. Aside from the necessity of teaching, practicing, and reinforcing procedures for these students (I of the Teaching model), paint positive images/pictures/visualizations. We act on the images in our brain. (This is a corollary to self-talk. See the opening few sentences in the book), For additional suggestions download the pdf at http://www.marvinmarshall.com/pdf/dealing_with_difficult_students.pdf http://www.marvinmarshall.com/pdf/dealing_with_difficult_students.pdf
for Jenny	The approach is a totally different approach to thinking and relating. It will not happen overnight. It is learning process. The learning is on the part of the adult. Students will not come to school any differently than they are now. But they will change if you follow the teaching model.
for Marilyn	Thanks for sharing. William Glasser (of whose institute I am certified) uses the same basic idea--which he borrowed from William Powers. (Dr. Glasser has since changed this "title" from CONTROL THEORY to CHOICE THEORY. Bill Glasser meant that one can only control oneself--but it was interpreted differently, which is the reason that he changed the title. My expereinces have taught me that if some thing is going to be replicated, it must be simple. The three principles to practice (II of the teaching model) are universal and enduring principles to improve relationships--your final point. One of my favoriet quotes from Myron Tribus, a formet MIT professor and devotee of W. Edwards Deming, capturs your main point: THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS IMMACULATE PERCEPTION; WHAT YOU SEE IS WHAT YOU THOUGHT BEFORE YOU LOOKED.
for David	WestSide Story is a modern version of Romeo and Juliet. Encourage your students to rent the video or DVD. I am not suprised that your students can handle it. Jerome Bruner stated in his classic little book, THe PROCESS OF EDUCATION that anything can be taught at any level. I consulted with the New York City Board of Education for three years working with students in Harlem and in Upper Manhattan. One of the middle schools was using my book to discuss how people have the CHOICE OF RESPONSE to any situation, stimulation, or urge. Young people can redirect their impulses--if they have a procedure. Students CAN react in a positive way to negative peer influence once they can articulate the difference between INTERNAL and EXTERNAL motivation. (I know that all motivation is internal--but requires more explanation than allowed here.) My point: implementing II, III, and IV of the teaching model is the most successful approach. A major reason for this is that many urban students are in "poverty," and two of the most important factors to them are RELATIONSHIPS and entertainment. Practicing the three principals accomplish the former. I NEVER suggest that teachers not be in control. Althouth the system is noncoercive, IT IS NOT PERMISSIVE. A major point for teachers to explain is that if students operate on level B, the teacher needs to be a level B teacher just to surviive. A MAJOR POINT IS THAT STUDENTS HAVE A DETERMINATING VOICE IN THE TYPE OF TEACHER THEY WANT. My article in ECUCATION WEEK, "RETHINKING OUR THINKING ON DISCIPLINE--EMPOWER RATHER THAN OVERPOWER," states my case. Have high expactation, level C or D, and then empower--rather than overpower. However, this will not work unless the students do not have negative feelings toward the teacher. The reason is a fact of life: We act on our feeling more than on our cognition. Regarding NCLB, it will fall on its face if for no other reason that NOTHING SUCCEEDS OVER TIME IF IT IT IS BASED ON A NEGATIVE APPROACH--and NCLB punishment-based. Regarding how you react to it, this is a choice. The pressure is there because it is labeled as pressure. I am not denying it exists, but what you do and how you react to it is A choice. As William Glasser once told me during a luncheon conversation, "IN BASEBALL,WHEN IS AN 'OUT' AN 'OUT.' WHEN THE UMPIRE CALLS IT AN OUT, AND NOT UNTIL."
For Marion	I am currently in the process of writing a parenting book entitled, DISCIPLINE WITHOUT STRESS FOR PARENTS - 3 KEYS TO RAISING RESPONSIBLE KIDS WHILE KEEPING A LIFE OF YOUR OWN. The book is basically my current book without chapters 4 and 5. See the Table of Contents at http://DisciplineWithoutStress.com. In the meantime, dowload the pdf, TIPS FOR PARENTS at http://www.marvinmarshall.com/tips4parents.pdf. Regarding reasons that society has changed, I can list 21 of the top of my head. (They are in the Resource Guide that comes with my In-House Staff Development package.) When I returned to the classroom after 24 years in counseling, staff development, and adminsitration, what popped out at me was that the current generation was not as responsible as former generations. This prompted my developing the RAISE RESPONSBILITY SYSTEM, my presenting for PDK, and PDK asking me to write a FASTBACK (now discontinued but I have some copies left.) The FASTBACK prompted, in part, my writing my current book.
for Davd - military	Teach the three principles described in the first chapter of my book, Roman Numeral Ii of the teaching model, in various places on my website, and in the two pdf's regarding DEALING WITH DIFFICULT STUDENTS AND TIPS FOR PARENTS. Have a classroom meeting ( CHAPTER 4, PROMOTING LEARNING) about the three princples to practice. . Discuss them. Students will see how practicing each of the principles will deter them from victimhood thinking, put them more in control of their lives, and reduce their negative thoughts. Another, and perhaps the best approach, is to implement the exercise on pages 25 and 26 of the book.
Christopher Plum	What parts of the principles can be effectively taught in pre-k and preschool programs? Specifically, we are encountering aggressive behaviors in 3 year olds (biting, hiting, pushing, etc.). Parents understand that it is an issue as well and are looking for help in curbing these behaviors.
for Christopher	I-Teaching procedure. II-(a) Creating poitive visions of what you want, not want you don't want. (b) Offer choices--two that you suggest and leave it open for the student to suggest. See the text to use at http://www.marvinmarshall.com/impulsemanagement.html. (c) Ask reflective questions as in the text, viz., do you really want to grow up by being a victim all your life? If not what procedure can we come up with where you will be in control of you impulses and feel better about yourself? III-(a)Teach the levels. see the primary poster at http://www.marvinmarshall.com/aquickstart.htm. (b) Refer to the above to have the youngster come up with the procedrue. Be prepared to repeat the entire process. To be successful, the procedure for impulse control must come from the child--even at three years old.
Doris	I can see where many of the adults that I currently work with could benefit greatly from these concepts, yet we're stuck with NCLB and high stakes testing. If the students don't learn the needed social/emotional skills as children, then they lack a significant piece of social/emotional intelligence which often times causes problems in the work place. Do you have any plans on writing on this aspect?
Marion	A TV program this spring said that children who have lived in great fear have black spots, "holes", in their brains which never develop fully. Therefore these people are unable to function fully emotionally and socially, and have "meltdowns" more often than others as they are unable to deal with problems as "normal" peope do. Is this right? Can your program help these people?
for Doris	The teaching model at http://www.marvinmarshall.com/in-housedetails.html can be taught in any situation--especially when implementing NCLB. It promtoes emotional attendance for both adults and young peope.
Gay Wiseman	THANK YOU very much, Dr. Marshall, for bringing us this powerful information, and sharing with us during this meeting from your wealth of understanding of classroom relationships, and the human learning experience. I know I will spend more time thinking through this material, and planning ways to implement it in my classroom next term. (I'm also signing up for your email list).